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RE: Common ceratopsian horn ailments

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Andy Farke [SMTP:andyfarke@hotmail.com]
> Sent: Tuesday, August 18, 1998 6:00 PM
> To:   dinosaur@usc.edu; majestic_cheese@yahoo.com; Dwight.Stewart@VLSI.com
> Subject:      RE: Common ceratopsian horn ailments
> The reference you are referring to here was published by R. S. Lull in 
> his 1933 monograph. He illustrated part of the squamosal of the YPM 1831 
> specimen, I believe. It was examined by a Dr. Mook(?) I think, and he 
> compared it to bone lesions found in human remains. The photos I've seen 
> are interesting, but I don't know for sure whether it was bone cancer or 
> not. A re-examination of the problem would be nice.
        [Stewart, Dwight]  -------------------------------
        Yep!  El Correcto! :-)  It was.  And it was a Dr. Mook, who is a
cancer specialist.  I have or HAD a copy
        of that paper.  The photos surely LOOKED like lesions, but...  I may
have also read that in another
        reference.  Anyway, I'm still searching through my books; MANY of
which are still packed after a
        recent move.  I'll update if I locate the 2nd reference.

> Regarding other pathologies, the St. Paul Science Museum Triceratops has 
> a nice drainage-canal in the jugal. Also, some Torosaurus caudal 
> vertebrae I've seen have monster drainage canals, indicating some sort 
> of painful infection. The whole centrum is warped.
> C. W. Gilmore published drawings of a Triceratops orbital horn that was 
> injured and re-healed. The horn was broken about 2/3 of the way up, and 
> rounded over into a kind of stump. I have a picture of that one laying 
> around some where. In the same paper, Gilmore illustrated some nice 
> cross-sectional views of Triceratops skulls, and a scapula with a 
> massive spur coming off of the blade. Gilmore is definitely one of the 
> un-sung heroes of paleontology.
> I'm trying to think of other injuries I've seen in the horns, but I 
> can't think of them off-hand (too late in the day).
> Hope that helps,
> Andy Farke
        [Stewart, Dwight]

        It makes sense (ALWAYS risky in science) that ceratopsians would
suffer injuries, especially to
        horns, frills, etc.  This occurs quite frequently in elephants
(tusks) & rhinos (horns).  There are 3 "white" rhinos in our city zoo, & the
large male has a truncated horn that appears to have broken off ~ 75% of the
way up & healed.
> Date: Mon, 17 Aug 1998 22:33:41 -0700
> From: "Stewart, Dwight" <Dwight.Stewart@VLSI.com>
> To: "'majestic_cheese@yahoo.com'" <majestic_cheese@yahoo.com>,
>         dinosaur@usc.edu
> Subject: RE: Common ceratopsian horn ailments
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> MIME-Version: 1.0
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> I read recently (will look for the reference) that evidence was found of
> "bone cancer" in a torosaurus fossil.  What that evidence was, I'm not 
> sure,
> because I don't recall the specifics.  Nevertheless, I'll look for the
> source tomorrow.
> Dwight
>         -----Original Message-----
>         From:   Larry Dunn [SMTP:majestic_cheese@yahoo.com]
>         Sent:   Friday, August 14, 1998 1:03 PM
>         To:     dinosaur@usc.edu
>         Subject:        Common ceratopsian horn ailments
>         What, if anything, does the fossil record tell us about common
>         ailments of ceratopsian (or ceratopian, if you prefer) horns? 
>         Breakage, problematic rehealings (if this happened), rot, 
> possible
>         problems due to prior malnutrition, whatever.
>         If there is a decent amount of material, if it genus or species
>         specific or common to all ceratopsians?
>         Most importantly, how would it manifest itself physically?  For
>         instance, how would part of a horn have broken off? Please be
> specific
>         if you can so that I get a decent idea of what I'd be looking at 
> if
> I
>         were standing a few feet from the head of the animal.
>         An odd question, but thanks for any help,
>         ==
>         Larry
>         "Atheism -- a non-prophet organization"
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