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> << Who cares whether the groups are extant or not? There are a
> known fossil taxa (_Triceratops_, _Gastonia_, _Dicraeosaurus_,
> are "manifestly not birds", yet fall inside your definition of
>... You might
> find it interesting and insightful to think of them as large, very
> heavy-bodied, quadrupedal birds.
Primitive? If Triceratops is descended from a small volant reptile,
it is a lot more derived than Archaeopteryx, or even modern birds.
I think I'll avoid the question of whether any human beings I know are
manifestly not bats.
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