My response to Dr.
Holtz: (his text is preceded by ">>")
> Microvenator is a
possible member of the Elmisauridae which is what
I seem to pick up from other
> dinosaur sites.
Caenagnathus is not a valid taxa whereas Elmisaurus is
therefore the clade should be
> renamed to fit valid internal
Caenagnathus itself is not a valid taxon name (it seems to be a
junior synonym of Chirostenotes), Caenagnathidae is the accepted name
of the taxon comprised of all oviraptorosaurs closer to Chirostenotes
than to Oviraptor.
Although there is
little preserved in Microvenator, there do not seem to be derived
caenagnthid/elmisaurid features in it. I wonder if people placed it there
on their websites under the premise "its primitive, elmisaurids are primitive
(?!?!), so it must be an elmisaurid". Oviraptorosauria incertae
sedis is probably teh best for present.
> About the "coelurid-grade forms",
do you mean the ornitholestids and Coelurus? I'm still
working on the
> troodontids (actually, I forgot to put them in
the when I wrote my post). They could be dromaeosauroids,
> birds (?), arctometatarsalians or
"enigmosaurs". Personally, I think they may be somewhere between
> and dromeys.
>Agreed to all of the above. Troodontids do
seem to bop all over the cladogram, but seem to be settling in Paraves, and
maybe within Eumaniraptora.
>>You are mistaken about the wrist morphology
of ornithomimosaurs. Their carpals are >>NOT re-expanded: they are
instead reduced relative to the condition in typical theropods >>OR more
> I just meant that...No wait, I'm confused
and mistaken. And you are right on that. I guess working in
> museum and being a professional paleontologist
gives you access to stuff I only can find in books or on the
(sensu J.A. Headden, DML)
(implied Matthew & Brown, 1922)
like it. I'd also like to say that Archaeornithoides and
Byronsaurus may indeed be very closely related, but more work needs
to be done.
> There for now, I hold this view but I
don't know what to do with everyone coelurosaurs, especially the
> dryptosaurids, coelurans, ornitholestids,
compsognathids, tyrannosaurs and ornithomimosaurs. I think
> Sereno's Tyrannoraptora might
Actually, Sereno's Tyrannoraptor is
Tyrannosaurus + Neornithes. In many recent phylogenies, this
clade would contain Maniraptoriformes: it might also contain some of the taxa
> Just one last thing, though... WHAT
ABOUT TALLUSCOATUM? No one seems to want to talk about
post was the first I have heard about it, and a websearch came up only with
your post to the Dinosauricon. Darned if I know: I've not heard the
name. It could be that they misspelled the name of the
mentioned there that the "description sounded fishy". If you could
remember (and post) something about the description, maybe we can piece
together what they were talking about.