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Re: Details on SVP 2002 Part 1

Mickey Mortimer (Mickey_Mortimer111@msn.com) wrote:

<Wilson and Upchurch discussed the identity of Titanosaurus.  Most species
were made nomina dubia, though I'll have to see the evidence for myself.
Supposedly indeterminate species included T. indicus, T. blanfordi, T.
falloti, T. lydekkeri, T. madagascariensis, T. nanus, T. rahiolensis(?),
> robustus(?) and T. valdensis.  T. falloti was previously referred to
Tangvayosaurus, T. madagascariensis to Rapetosaurus and the new
saltasaurine, and T. valdensis to Iuticosaurus.  It's things like this
that make me doubt that all these taxa can be undiagnostic.  But we'll
see. "Titanosaurus" colberti was given a new genus name, and Laplatasaurus
was kept as a separate genus.>

  Well, first off, *T. robustus* was made into *Janenshia* years ago, *T.
falloti* was regarded by Buffetaut et al. as maybe similar to
*Tangvayosaurus*, but was not referred in that paper, and was never really
compared there. *T. nanus* is *Pleurocoelus*, and the others are
essentially based on crap. Sorry, fragments and shards of peices of larger
bones with concurrent titanosaurian bones between them, they might be
diagnostic if we had more of them. *T. madagascariensis* was, if I
remember correctly, comprised of parts of two different grades of
titanosaurs, and only the type can provide instability of the nomen. If
the type is referred to *Rapetosaurus*, then *R. krausei* is sunk into *T.
madagascariensis* as *Rapetosaurus madagascariensis*. Similarly, if
falloti proves to be Tangvayo, which I consider to be very likely, it's
*Tangvayosaurus falloti*, not *T. hoffeti*. Most of the other Indian
species are based on incomparable materials, isolated caudal centra or
fibulae, braincases (of which I understand there are two or three
different kinds). *T. valdensis* has also been included in the
brachiosaur-like *Pleurocoelous*. They seem to be sinking a lot of taxa,
and I would LOVE to see their justifications for many of these. I am still
personally pursuring the measure of variability in titanosaur tails to see
how diagnostic a caudal can be. And I didn't say it was non-diagnostic
crap, just crap. Most materials can be referred to the Titanosauria, and
that's diagnostic enough.


Jaime A. Headden

  Little steps are often the hardest to take.  We are too used to making leaps 
in the face of adversity, that a simple skip is so hard to do.  We should all 
learn to walk soft, walk small, see the world around us rather than zoom by it.

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