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Re: More concerning the Triceratops/Torosaurus deal

Hi DMLers

I mean, ok I'm just a layman, and ok, am therefore no specialist,
but, concerning this topic, I want to know: how many "species"(taxa?) are expected to be found within a "family"(taxon?) pertaining to the same clade? Why is it that _Torosaurus_ has to be _Triceratops_ adlut stage? Ontogeny is a nice thing. But what if this was based on incomplete fossil preservation, like _Toro_ would be a parent clade (?above genus level) of _Triceratops_ , and only subadult stages of the latter had been found? Given the quite fast evolution of ceratopids during the Cretaceous, is it impossible to think that this "_Toro_ adult" stage of _Triceratops_ is actually a subadult stage of an adult _Triceratops_ yet to be found? And, by the same way, that young or subadlut _Toro_ have not yet been found?

Don't know if I've made my ideas clear

Cheers anyway, as usual!


(you might sense that I'm very fond of _Triceratops_...)

----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Erickson" <tehdinomahn@live.com>
To: "Dino List" <dinosaur@usc.edu>
Sent: Thursday, October 29, 2009 12:29 AM
Subject: More concerning the Triceratops/Torosaurus deal

Greg Paul's mention of a rumor about a juvie *Torosaurus* made me think of something else that might have bearing on the *Torosaurus* as adult *Triceratops* issue - that bigbutt *Triceratops* skull at the BYU Earth and Science Museum. I know it hasn't been described (at least, to my knowledge it hasn't), but according to Luis Rey, Bakker and a couple others who claim to have seen it, it is at least as large as the largest specimens of *Torosaurus*. It is apparently very, very massive. Too bad they won't dust the thing off and publish something on it. But anyway, I wonder - would a *Triceratops* skull the size of the biggest *Torosaurus* skulls, and showing no sign of fenestrae opening up, refute the notion that Toro is the adult stage of Trike?

Just a thought.

~ Michael

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