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Re: Flightless pterosaur question:



Jaime,

So far I haven't claimed anyone wrong, When one party suggested absurdly short 
wings, that's a good answer and fairly obvious, but I wanted to know what the 
threshold betwen long enough and not quite long enough might be. Was that bad 
to redirect the question to a tighter focus? 

but as for your swand and buzzard answer, I have no problem with large mass 
evenly distributed so that the center of mass is at the wing root. The only 
mention of mass I made was a mass shift, either forward or back. Any pilot 
knows you have to figure out where the luggage and passengers go with regard to 
balance.

So, I think you misread my questions or my statement and, as a result, the 
insult was misguided. 

And, if you'll look back on my thread, my questions were not vague. I'm looking 
for a mathematician or an engineer to help in this problem. I'm not planning to 
rely on tracings. So again, a misguided insult. 

Some things I just don't know, so I ask questions. 

David 





On Mar 25, 2010, at 5:53 AM, Jaime Headden wrote:

> 
>   There's a big difference between obligate and faculative loss of flight 
> ability, especially when dealing with the gross mass to wing mass ratio. 
> Swans and buzzards, sporting the heaviest flying birds, are several degrees 
> more massive than their jungle fowl counter parts, but the latter tend not to 
> fly, whiel the former do "fly" and "soar" and do so dynamically often. So 
> mass is not evena  really good indicator without deep studies. I daresay 
> tracings won't find the answer.
> 
>   You should argue FOR something and debate its merits instead of trying to 
> get other peoples' vague attempts to answer a question you vaguely ask, and 
> thn claim their answers are "easy," as if they were apparently wrong.
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Jaime A. Headden
> 
> "Innocent, unbiased observation is a myth." --- P.B. Medawar (1969)
> 
> 
> "Human beings, who are almost unique in having the ability to learn
> from the experience of others, are also remarkable for their apparent
> disinclination to do so." --- Douglas Adams (Last Chance to See)
> 
> 
> "Ever since man first left his cave and met a stranger with a
> different language and a new way of looking at things, the human race
> has had a dream: to kill him, so we don't have to learn his language or
> his new way of looking at things." --- Zapp Brannigan (Beast With a Billion 
> Backs)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ----------------------------------------
>> Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2010 10:05:03 -0700
>> From: davidpeters@att.net
>> To: saint_abyssal@yahoo.com
>> CC: dinosaur@usc.edu
>> Subject: Re: Flightless pterosaur question:
>> 
>> Of course, but that's the easy answer. Some flightless birds do not have 
>> absurdly short wings.
>> 
>> What's the threshold for flight/flightlessness?
>> 
>> Could it be found in the pectoral girdle, rather than the wings?
>> 
>> Witness the Kagu:
>> 
>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kagu
>> 
>> "The wings are not reduced in size like some other flightless birds, but 
>> they lack the musculature for flight."
>> 
>> D
>> 
>> 
>> --- On Wed, 3/24/10, Saint Abyssal  wrote:
>> 
>> 
>>> Absurdly short or gracile flight
>>> digits?
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> If flightless birds keep their wings,
>>>> how will we know (or what threshold will they cross)
>>> that
>>>> tells us a pterosaur just can't fly?
>>>> 
>>>> Any predictions?
>>>> 
>>>> David Peters
>>>> davidpeters@att.net
>>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>                                         
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